Delaware Concealed Carry Forum
CCW Methods & Issues => General CCW Discussion => Topic started by: Moosie on January 16, 2010, 04:03:48 PM
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So, I was reading a very good discussion on another forum about whether or not to tell a police officer (without being asked) if you're carrying concealed or not. Most often, this is via a vehicle stop but it can be during other routine encounters. Delaware doesn't have a law that states you must automatically notify an LEO that you're authorized to carry concealed or that you are carrying concealed.
Recently, I was stopped for speeding. I did not notify the trooper I was carrying. Why? Because it wasnt relevant. He didnt ask, I didnt tell. I didnt have to go anywhere near my gun to get my license, registration, or insurance card. If I had, I would have certainly told him.
What's your thought / take on telling or keeping quiet?
Moosie
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i agree with you. there is no need to tell him,unless he needs to search you or your car. not for a routine traffic stop.
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I would most definitely tell the officer that I was carring a firearm, In this case It can't hurt, and I think It may just get you out of a ticket, now that he knows that you have a clean record and you are one of the good guys!!! This Is just how I feel about it, but to each his own. I'm not to sure If It's mandatory or not In Delaware, I will look Into it. But like I said, I don't think it would do any harm to say so.
Lets put It another way, and I'm not crazy about " what Ifs " I get stopped by Tim the trooper, for whatever? and I have to bend over to get my paper work from my glove box and while doing so my jacket pulls up enough so that Tim the Trooper spots my handgun, what do you think Is going to bang Tim right on top of his head, If Tim's light does not go on, then Tim was not trained to well and he should go right back to the Police Academy!!! Lets bring this up a notch or two.
Lets say that Tim the Trooper just found out that one of his class mates from the same Academy was just shot and killed at a traffic stop by some nut job that looked like a school teacher, She was having a bad hair day and she just had a fight with her husband, who also beat her up, Hows that for " What Ifs " The two most dangerous things a cop has to deal with Is " Traffic stops and " Domestic violence "
Think about It at your next traffic stop gang??? And have a nice day, Hank
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I have to agree with Hank on this after talking to numerous Officer both County, State, Wilmington and New Castle I think its best to let them know in this case its better to let them know then find out by accident. I have nothing to hide. I would just give them my permit with my drivers license.
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I wouldn't tell unless he asks or wants me to exit the vehicle. Any time I've been pulled over I've always gotten my drivers license, proof of insurance etc out before he even gets out of the car, no matter what he wants that info, so if you have it ready there's no way you will accidentaly show your gun. I've asked several officers that I know and almost all have said they would rather not know. One of them had had somebody tell them they were carrying and his words were "all I heard is I have a gun on me".IMHO get everything ready to go, have your wallet in your hand and comply but no need to give him too much info.
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again i agree with gun envy. dont ask dont tell
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when i enter my car, my wallet comes out of my pocket and sits right in the console,, registration and insurance is right over the visor. if i ever get stopped i pull to the side and immediately turn on interior lights and both hands remain on the wheel until asked to show drivers license and registration. Then i can simply hand it to him in plain sight with out going in my pockets or into the glove box and not making the officer nervous for any reason. if i carried i don't think i would mention it unless the law required that i do so or i was asked to step from the vehicle or asked if i had any weapons on me. to me it would be none of their business to know i was carrying and i wouldn't tell them for the same reason i would never allow a search of my vehicle even though i have nothing in it to hide. it can be a slippery slope and you may run into an officer who think he has just solved the last shooting when he finds out you are carrying and will do a further investigation. and even though i would have nothing to hide i wouldn't want to go through all that and waste my time. get the ticket and go on my way, good evening officer = )
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Hi again all.
Sinse I wrote on 1-17-10 I have given this a little more think time. And I have something to add. As of now I have a CCW from DE. FL. & PA. In that order, and with the reciprocity laws being different In all states, I carry my drivers license and all my CCWs In a small folder. I have my drivers license and my DE. CCW up front, or on top and the other two states behind them and that small folder sits right In the main part of my wallet, when I open my wallet that the first thing you will see. I have had my CCW from PA. for ten years ( that's when we lived In PA. ) and not the one I just got. The out of state,CCW.
I will always state that I'm carrying a license firearm, This way I don't have to remember what state I'm In, and what are the laws In this state!!! I will never say the word GUN, that's akin to shouting fire In a theater to some??? I must also say here that I have not been stopped In more than 15-18 years??? The last time I was stopped was when we did live In PA. and that was before I had my first CCW from there, WOW! We have lived here In DE. for 6 years now, And It's a Joy!!!
I would also not let anyone search my car, Maybe if they were looking for a missing rattle snake that was last seen by my car, Maybe??? More " What If's " You never know what's comming next!!!
I only say what I would do and I'm not telling others what to do or say, I hope we are all adults on here, and you all can makeup your own minds.
One more little tid bit, I talked to someone that was a cop and I ask him, If you stopped someone that had a CCW, but did not tell you, and you then found out, would you give this person a worning or a ticket? He said I would by all means give that person a ticket!!! Now lets turn that around and say that same person told you of there CCW up front, what would you now do, and he said I would give them a worning, If all things were equil!!! And please remember, that this Is just one cop, and like us, they all think differently.
Semper Fi all. Hank.
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Hank you bring up some very good points!
Yes, I would hope that we are all adults here -- especially if we have a CCDW permit! That being said, feedback or hearing from others and the experiences they have had is always good. One person can not think about every angle to every situation. Thats what I love about the boards here. Everyone is willing to share their honest opinion about whatever the subject may be. And so far (at least not that I've seen), no one has gotten bent out of shape over the information exchange. Ok, maybe I did one time LOL. But it was because I misread what was written. No harm, no foul.
I have also decided that if I ever get stopped again, I'll be handing my DL and my CCW permit over at the same time. I realized after thinking about this whole situation over and over again, that I had never given it any thought about getting stopped while carrying! Nope.. brilliant as it sounds, I just figured, I'd keep my hands on the wheel and say something along the lines of "I'm carrying a concealed firearm". BUT... I panicked! Yes, I was all out of sorts when I got stopped. No idea why.. the worst is that the trooper could give me a ticket, right?!
Regardless of what I might do, or anyone else chooses to do here, we should all do what is comfortable to us, and depending on what state you're in, what the law tells us to do.
Thanks for everyone's feedback.
Moosie aka Rebecca
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Hi again all.
Just to show how some people do not know the laws In our state and other states. yesterday late afternoon, 400PM or so, I was at J D Defense picking up a new pistol that I ordered from John, and this guy came In to pck up a handgun that he had also ordered. John ask the guy for a drivers license and something else with the same address on it, he gave John a Florida out of state carry license, and John ask him If he had a Delaware Carry license? He said no. John tried to tell him that the Florida license Is only good In Delaware If he lived In FL. and was passing through DE. and he started to give John a somewhat hard time??? John also told him if he was carrying a handgun consealed and a cop stopped him, he would go to jail, and the guy tried to tell John, no that his FL. Around and around we go again!!! John knows the laws.
Some one else on here was also carrying a handgun In PA. on a out of state FL. carry license, and I tried to tell him that It was not alowed, and that he would have to get an out of state PA. Carry license as I did. You can not just read part of the law, you must read It all, or you will get a nice brand new stripped suite for your very own. " Ignorance of the law Is no excuse " And also the laws change from time to time and state to state. If you screw up In another state, the state you live In will not take that to lightly, and there Is a very good chance that It could cost you the right to ever carry a firearm again??? I'm just telling you what I know, so don't give me a hard time, if you don't like what I say!!! A word to the wise!!!.
Semper Fi all. Hank.
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the best place to keep track of the changing laws is http://www.handgunlaw.us/. you can read the laws of each state you plan on visting.
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Hi all.
I agree with Glock 9. I just ordered the brand new Travelers Guide to the Firearm Laws of the Fifty States, for 2010, and I'll bet you before I get It, there will be changes to some state laws!!! The last copy that I had was 2008. The new one goes for $13.95 with ground shipping, Pony Express??? I do hope they feed the pony down here In our little one room post office???
Take care all.Semper Fi all. Hank.
In God we trust, all others pay cash!!!
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Some one else on here was also carrying a handgun In PA. on a out of state FL. carry license, and I tried to tell him that It was not alowed, and that he would have to get an out of state PA. Carry license as I did. You can not just read part of the law, you must read It all, or you will get a nice brand new stripped suite for your very own.
Hank, I may have misunderstood, but the PA Atty General's website has this " It is the position of the Office of Attorney General that recognition within Pennsylvania is based on the issuance to an individual of a valid license/permit by the reciprocal contracting state, and not on the license/permit holder's place of residence. " (http://www.attorneygeneral.gov/crime.aspx?id=184)
Could you show me a cite where PA says they don't accept FL for nonresidents?
(I have PA LTCF anyway, very easy to obtain, but wanted to check the whole FL nonresident thing)
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Hi Trevor.
If that was you I was talking about? I was not taking a cheep shot at you,I was trying to save you some jail time and ever worse, you would loose your right to ever carry again,In any state!!! and that's all. If and when you got your Florida CCW/CCDW? You should have gotten a yellow sheet, telling you what states your CCW Is valid In, and for PA. It has a little#1 & #6 by It, If you turn that yellow sheet over It will tell you just what #1 & #6 are, #6= ( These states issue concealed carry licenses to qualified individuals who are non-residents. These non-residents permits connot be honored under Florida's reciprocity provision. ) I got this yellow sheet from Florida with my out of state, or non residents CCW. I have talked to people In the know and I was told that for me to carry In PA. I would have to get an out of state/ or non-resident CCW from PA. Which I did. I have a FL.and also DE.I didn't get this one just for kicks.
I was In JD Defense picking up a new gun that I ordered from my good friend John Davis, who owend It, and Is a retired Georgetown policemen, He was an instructor on weapons and he also has FBI training. He held the rank of Lt. While I was there another person came Into pick up a pistol that he had also ordered. John needed 2 proofs ( IDs )with the same home address on them, one had to be a Delaware drivers license, and he needed another one with the same address on It. So this person takes out a non-resident CCW from Florida with his address on it, and John then ask him If he had a DE. CCDW with the same adderss, and he said No. He then told John that he carries In DE. on his FL. CCW. John told him that he could not do that and the guy started to give John a list of why he could. John then told him that If gets stopped and he has a gun on him, he will go to jail.
Trevor, you go and do whatever you like, a word to the wise??? Just remember I tried to worn you. Closed case, Good luck, Hank.
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Hi again all.
I see in my rush to answer Trevor, I am repeting myself, I said the same thing twice,I guess I'm as bad as some of the lawyers, that write the law so that no one can understand It, not even themselves??? And everyone that tries to make sense of It, can't. I include myself In that. And most of all, we must look out for the ones that make the rules, and don't have to live by them. I know, Off the soap box Hank.
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Are we trying to make APPLES = ORANGES here????
Hank,
I think you are Trevor are looking at different states. Trevor quoted the info from PA AG's site stating it the CCW they honor and NOT where you reside.http://www.attorneygeneral.gov/crime.aspx?id=184 (http://www.attorneygeneral.gov/crime.aspx?id=184)
Note: It has come to the attention of the Office of Attorney General that there has been
confusion over the applicability of Pennsylvania's reciprocal privileges with regard to the residency
status of an individual who has been issued a valid license/permit. It is the position of the
Office of Attorney General that recognition within Pennsylvania is based on the issuance to
an individual of a valid license/permit by the reciprocal contracting state,
and not on the license/permit holder's place of residence.
Hank YOU are quoting from FL here: http://licgweb.doacs.state.fl.us/news/concealed_carry.html (http://licgweb.doacs.state.fl.us/news/concealed_carry.html)
Which states:
(6) These states issue concealed carry licenses to qualified individuals who are non-residents.
These non-resident permits cannot be honored under Florida's reciprocity provision.
In reading this YOUR FL permit will be honored on PA EVEN IF you are NOT a resident of FL. But, your PA permit will NOT be honored in FL if you are NOT al resident of PA.
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Thanks, Radnor,
Hank, I've got to appologize for my post not saying what I meant.
This Florida website has some of what is on the back of that yellow sheet: http://licgweb.doacs.state.fl.us/news/concealed_carry.html
As you correctly stated, it says
" Pennsylvania (1,6)"
"1) While Florida's law allows licensees to carry stun guns, knives, and billy clubs in a concealed fashion, the laws in these states allow for concealed carry of handguns or pistols ONLY, NOT WEAPONS IN GENERAL. Florida license holders are prohibited from carrying other types of weapons while in these states."
"(6) These states issue concealed carry licenses to qualified individuals who are non-residents. These non-resident permits cannot be honored under Florida's reciprocity provision."
I think # 6 is where they say what Radnor's saying, that FLA disallows non-resident PA.
They left #4 off the list, which does list CO, MI, NH, and SC, the states that explicitly disallow FLA NON-resident permits.
(4) These states will honor the Florida concealed weapon license ONLY IF the licensee is a resident of the State of Florida.
Anyway, sorry, I didn't say it very well. And no worries...I do have my DE resident CCDW, as well as FLA and PA non-resident permits.
And, Don't tell the wife :-X, I just got my C&R in the mail...there probably is a Mosin-Nagant in the near future ;D
I'll have to stay out of CO >:(, MI >:(, NH >:(, and SC >:(, as well as NY >:( and NJ >:(...not too much of a loss. ;)
No harm, no foul...I appreciate you having my best interests ;)...now, if you could help me find some inexpensive 9mm.....
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Trevor,
You missed PRMD. hopefully the MD thing will pass. But I'm NOT holding my breath.
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yes...and MD >:( >:(...
But I can't imagine MD would ever give reciprocity when virtually none of its own residents can carry.
People can say what they will about DE's process, cheesy card, etc, but at least it is obtainable with reasonable effort, and it doesn't require political connections.
To your point, I've stopped shopping in Elkton due to carrying. I used to avoid the Walmart at the 13/40 split due to its clientele, and now I avoid the one in Elkton due to MD's CC law...but I no longer mind the 13/40 store...'cause I'm not defenseless. Kinda ironic...
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Yeah, 13/40..... That's so you can pick up ammo to feed that little girls' habit. :)
How is she shootin?
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Hi everyone.
I will try one more time before the snow starts to fall???
I have my DE. CCDW, I also have my Non resident CCW from FL. And I got my non resident CCW from PA. I'm not out to collect then just for fun. I'm not reading all the laws from the other states and telling everyone just what they mean, not by a long shot you do your own hamework!!! I can't make heads or tails out of them!!! If you want to find out about the gun laws In any state, you had better go find a lawyer from that state that specializes In that law, In that state, and even with that, he could still be wrong.
Any time two or more lawyers go Into court, most of the time at least one If not more will be found wrong by the judge, And I would no bet my life on the judge???
I'm just stating what I think I know, you people can do whatever you like!!! I will cover my butt, If you want to leave yours to chance, be my guest.
In God we trust, all others pay cash. Semper Fi all. Hank
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I just stated what was PRINTED in their websites.
The ONLY thing I can wish for all is, may we NEVER have to "use" any of the cards.
Be safe Hank. And, thank you for your service.
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Hay Radno, No harm & no foul.
I don't have a dog in this fight, I have covered my butt as far as I know???
and If I'm wrong about something that I state here, no harm & no foul! But on the other hand, If you ( I don't mean you personally ) tell someone/anyone that what they are doing Is right, and It's not, and they go to jail, I think then we may have some harm? Some of them people In the bule suits and robes like to say " Ignorance of the law, Is no excuse " and they will put you In jail happely for screwing up In there part of town??? I have been around for a long time and I have seen a done a lot. I also have had my foot In my mouth more times than I like to remember. I well know that talk is cheap, and so Is advice. I do a lot of one and try to stay away from the other.
I went for my FL. none resident CCW , thinking It would cover me up In PA. I found out that It may not be so, I checked and It was one of them " grey areas ", so I than went for my PA. non resident CCW to make sure, $26.00? I'm not going to leave things to chance. I even had someone question me about using the term " Non resident CCW. " telling me they could not find that term In the FL.law, anyplace??? I tryed to answer that? But some people are very hard to please.
In God we trust, the rest pay cash.
Semper Fi all. Hank.
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Please cite the PA code where it states as a resident of DE they will NOT honor you FL non-res ticket.
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Hi Radnor.
I may be wrong, but for $26.00 I'm not going to sweat It, I have spent many thousands of $ on all kind of guns over many years. And I'm not going to fight with you over this. I'm not telling anyone what they should do or not do. A word to the wise, That's It!!!
Hank.
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What I just read on the PA site was that you must have a legal permit to carry concealed in your HOME state for them to honor your out of state PA carry permit. That being said, I think your bases are covered as long as the state you claim as your home state is one that PA shares reciprocity with and you have a valid permit to carry in that home state.
Rebecca
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Hi everyone.
Let me fall on my sward and end this. I was probely wrong In what I said? ( The road to hell, Is paved with good Intentions ) I was told this by some one that I know, I was not trying to make any trouble, or give anyone any bad Info, I even went to the trouble of getting a PA. non resident CCW myself, and I have a FL. Non resident CCW, because I believed this to be true, I'm still out on this one, I'm not 100% sure on this one way or the other. So If I did cause anyone any trouble I apologize.
In God we trust, all others pay cash. Semper Fi all.Hank.