Delaware resident legal to CC with only Florida CCW permit

[scottf]

My Florida CC permit arrived before the Delaware permit (no surprise there) so I got to thinking. Can I legally Concealed Carry (CC) in Delaware as a Delaware resident, with only a Florida CC permit?

I read the statute (http://delcode.delaware.gov/title11/c005/sc07/index.shtml#P1262_94811) and there doesn't appear to be any prohibition.

So, I decided to call the AG's office (302-577-8500) and ask. I left a message and got a call back from Jennifer (no last name) and we discussed the question. She was very emphatic that as long as you have a valid concealed carry permit from a State with whom Delaware has reciprocity (Florida being one of them), then you are legal to concealed carry in Delaware. I re-asked the question four different ways and she was insistent.

Now, I'm in process for the Delaware CCW permit, so this point will be moot in a few months (hopefully sooner than later). I don't plan on testing this with local law enforcement, since I'm in process for Delaware anyway.

I'm wondering if anyone had similar or conflicting information.

[Hawkeye]

Far be it from me to argue with the AG's office but I did find this:

§ 1442. Carrying a concealed deadly weapon; class G felony; class D felony.

A person is guilty of carrying a concealed deadly weapon when the person carries concealed a deadly weapon upon or about the person without a license to do so as provided by § 1441 of this title.
 
Carrying a concealed deadly weapon is a class G felony, unless the deadly weapon is a firearm, in which case it is a class D felony.

It shall be a defense that the defendant has been issued an otherwise valid license to carry a concealed deadly weapon pursuant to terms of § 1441 of this title, where:

(1) The license has expired,

(2) The person had applied for renewal of said license within the allotted time frame prior to expiration of the license, and

(3) The offense is alleged to have occurred while the application for renewal of said license was pending before the court.

11 Del. C. 1953, § 1442; 58 Del. Laws, c. 497, § 1; 59 Del. Laws, c. 547, § 13; 67 Del. Laws, c. 130, § 8; 70 Del. Laws, c. 186, § 1; 77 Del. Laws, c. 313, §§ 1, 6.;

I have to give the standard "I am not a lawyer" statement at this time but it appears to say that you cannot conceal carry in Delaware unless you go through the process of applying through the state of Delaware.  If I am wrong please correct me on this.

[Gorski]

I have always heard that you need a ccw permit in the state in which you are a resident of, you can carry in Fla or other recip states but not DE until you have a DE permit....

[scottf]

Far be it from me to argue with the AG's office but I did find this:

§ 1442. Carrying a concealed deadly weapon; class G felony; class D felony.

A person is guilty of carrying a concealed deadly weapon when the person carries concealed a deadly weapon upon or about the person without a license to do so as provided by § 1441 of this title.

I have to give the standard "I am not a lawyer" statement at this time but it appears to say that you cannot conceal carry in Delaware unless you go through the process of applying through the state of Delaware.  If I am wrong please correct me on this.

The link I gave is for § 1441. That's my point. Nowhere in § 1441 does it state you have to have the license issued by the State of Delaware. § 1441 specifically states that CCW permits are accepted from States that have reciprocity with Delaware. Nowhere in § 1441 does it preclude a Delaware resident.

Now, having stated the above, I realize that I could be completely wrong. Having been both a plaintiff and a defendant many times, I have a full understanding that just because a statute says one thing, the AG, any prosecutor and any LEO can interpret it any way they please. That's what the courts are for. Personally, I have no desire to be the test case to challenge anyone's interpretation of § 1441.

I have now been told that "Jennifer" works for a Tony Davalos (spelling?). He is being quoted by someone I know as having the interpretation that a Delaware resident does in fact have to have a Delaware issued CCW permit, even if that person has another State's CCW permit with Delaware reciprocity. I have not spoken to him directly, so I have no idea on what he is basing that opinion.

I know a few judges, so I may go that route, just to get their opinion. However, said opinions may be off the record, so I'll report back what I can.

[Hawkeye]

The link I gave is for § 1441. That's my point. Nowhere in § 1441 does it state you have to have the license issued by the State of Delaware. § 1441 specifically states that CCW permits are accepted from States that have reciprocity with Delaware. Nowhere in § 1441 does it preclude a Delaware resident.

I believe to receive reciprocity for another state's CCW permit you need to be a resident of that state. IANAL so I may be missing something.

(j) Notwithstanding any other provision of this Code to the contrary, the State of Delaware shall give full faith and credit and shall otherwise honor and give full force and effect to all licenses/permits issued to the citizens of other states where those issuing states also give full faith and credit and otherwise honor the licenses issued by the State of Delaware pursuant to this section and where those licenses/permits are issued by authority pursuant to state law and which afford a reasonably similar degree of protection as is provided by licensure in Delaware. For the purpose of this subsection "reasonably similar" does not preclude alternative or differing provisions nor a different source and process by which eligibility is determined. Notwithstanding the forgoing, if there is evidence of a pattern of issuing licenses/permits to convicted felons in another state, the Attorney General shall not include that state under the exception contained in this subsection even if the law of that state is determined to be "reasonably similar." The Attorney General shall communicate the provisions of this section to the Attorneys General of the several states and shall determine those states whose licensing/permit systems qualify for recognition under this section. The Attorney General shall publish on January 15th of each year a list of all States which have qualified for reciprocity under this subsection. Such list shall be valid for one year and any removal of a State from the list shall not occur without 1 year's notice of such impending removal. Such list shall be made readily available to all State and local law-enforcement agencies within the State as well as to all then-current holders of licenses issued by the State of Delaware pursuant to this Section.

[Hawkeye]

Got the answer right here. E-mail is great.

Mr. Wright, a citizen of Delaware can only carry a concealed weapon with a valid Delaware permit.  Out of state permits from reciprocating states are only good for non-residents.  If you have any other questions, please call me.


Anthony R. Davolos
Office of Special Investigations
Department of Justice, OAG

[scottf]

Got the answer right here. E-mail is great.

Mr. Wright, a citizen of Delaware can only carry a concealed weapon with a valid Delaware permit.  Out of state permits from reciprocating states are only good for non-residents.  If you have any other questions, please call me.


Anthony R. Davolos
Office of Special Investigations
Department of Justice, OAG

As you mentioned, someone got arrested recently in Delaware with only a Florida CCW permit. Spoke to a Judge who joked "here's your chance to become famous". The Judge's take is that the language could be argued a number of ways and should be clearer. The way it is worded, a New Jersey resident could be legal in Delaware with a Florida CCW permit. However, all things being equal, the ruling would lean towards the State (AG/Prosecutor), especially in the case of an ambiguity and based on previous cases.

Thanks for the quick response on this.

[anjdrifter]

Not quite the right thread but thought I would interject something about renewal ... I have a De carry along with a few other non-resident permits.I have them  because I travel frequently to many different states and am qualified  thru NRA and different states to teach  courses on safety and also carry courses.( I am retired so am real lucky to do this).. I do this on a volunteer basis to promote safety and also right to carry. I dont this for busines and do mainly for friends and fellow range members in different states.My main permit is the DE because I live here and is the one I always present ,as it should be. anyway got way off area again... On Dec 19 2011 I recieved my renewal for Fla. and mailed it same day after getting printed in AM. well it came back Jan 10 2012   no fuss no muss and easy.. now that is cool way to do things

[Robdel302]

I have the same issue being a DE resident with a Florida license.  I contacted the AG a few years ago and they told me the same thing.  I must have a DE license to carry in the state.  I was specifially warned against pushing my luck because the judges probably wouldn't be lenient even though I'm active duty military.  Each state have different rules regarding reciprocity.  Some states allow their residents to carry even with an out-of-state license.  Delaware requires it's residents to have a Delware license.  I'm guessing it's because we're one of the few states with more lenient conceal carry restrictions.  DE is currently the only state I know of that allows you to carry in an establishment that serves alcohol.  This of course requires sound judgement of the licensee.

[mrjam2jab]

The link I gave is for § 1441. That's my point. Nowhere in § 1441 does it state you have to have the license issued by the State of Delaware. § 1441 specifically states that CCW permits are accepted from States that have reciprocity with Delaware. Nowhere in § 1441 does it preclude a Delaware resident.

I believe to receive reciprocity for another state's CCW permit you need to be a resident of that state. IANAL so I may be missing something.

(j) Notwithstanding any other provision of this Code to the contrary, the State of Delaware shall give full faith and credit and shall otherwise honor and give full force and effect to all licenses/permits issued to the citizens of other states where those issuing states also give full faith and credit and otherwise honor the licenses issued by the State of Delaware pursuant to this section and where those licenses/permits are issued by authority pursuant to state law and which afford a reasonably similar degree of protection as is provided by licensure in Delaware. For the purpose of this subsection "reasonably similar" does not preclude alternative or differing provisions nor a different source and process by which eligibility is determined. Notwithstanding the forgoing, if there is evidence of a pattern of issuing licenses/permits to convicted felons in another state, the Attorney General shall not include that state under the exception contained in this subsection even if the law of that state is determined to be "reasonably similar." The Attorney General shall communicate the provisions of this section to the Attorneys General of the several states and shall determine those states whose licensing/permit systems qualify for recognition under this section. The Attorney General shall publish on January 15th of each year a list of all States which have qualified for reciprocity under this subsection. Such list shall be valid for one year and any removal of a State from the list shall not occur without 1 year's notice of such impending removal. Such list shall be made readily available to all State and local law-enforcement agencies within the State as well as to all then-current holders of licenses issued by the State of Delaware pursuant to this Section.

This is correct.  DE resident must have a DE permit to carry in DE.  Not all states have this...but several do.

[wayne]

Interesting. Guess I get to holster the gun at home for a few years then.

After waiting for 5 months, going through all that red tape I was just rejected due to having too many traffic violations. Was told to wait 3 years and try again essentially.

So the FL one I have is worthless.. At least I know for sure where this stands now.

[joek]

How many traffic violations is too many?