Author Topic: WV residents with CCW can carry in Delaware...why?  (Read 11512 times)

NormH3

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WV residents with CCW can carry in Delaware...why?
« on: August 17, 2016, 09:15:29 PM »
I've been looking at different states that Delaware recognizes. WV only requires a simple form. Fill it out. Take it to the local sheriff. He signs off and forwards to the WVSP. No requirement for training. No ad in a paper. No references. Pretty cut and dry. Now here they make a residence take a course (not a bad thing), take out an ad and give 3 local references. How can Delaware except WV CCW holders and have Delaware citizens jump through all kinds of hoops. Sumthin' ain't right. (I know preaching to the choir)

http://www.wvsp.gov/forms/Documents/CWP44A.pdf

EDIT: forgot no fingerprints.
« Last Edit: August 17, 2016, 09:22:07 PM by NormH3 »

SturmRugerSR9

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Re: WV residents with CCW can carry in Delaware...why?
« Reply #1 on: August 17, 2016, 10:26:47 PM »
Actually you need 5 references in Delaware.
I'D RATHER HAVE A GUN IN MY HANDS, THAN A COP ON THE PHONE!

I reserve the right to not be perfect.

PROTECT THE 1ST AND 2ND AMENDMENT!

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NormH3

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Re: WV residents with CCW can carry in Delaware...why?
« Reply #2 on: August 17, 2016, 10:35:02 PM »
I stand corrected. It still doesn't make sense to me. Oh well. Unfortunately, if I was to make a complaint about it, Delaware would probably just break ties with WV.
« Last Edit: August 17, 2016, 10:37:40 PM by NormH3 »

NormH3

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Re: WV residents with CCW can carry in Delaware...why?
« Reply #3 on: August 20, 2016, 01:38:57 PM »
Thought I would get a few more comments and opinions on this. No one else feels slighted by the state that a non-resident can carry here easier than a resident?

CorBon

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Re: WV residents with CCW can carry in Delaware...why?
« Reply #4 on: August 20, 2016, 03:13:19 PM »
There are countless ways that I am offended by the State, the County, and simply put -- most of the short-bussers that I encounter once I leave the house.  The West Virginia situation, though, does not rise to the level of causing me more alarm.

I am not sure of West Virgini's current permitting system, but earlier this year West Virginia switched to being a "constitutional carry" state -- so no permit at all. I haven't looked, but they may have kept the permits for recipricocity (for those wanting to take advantage of such a thing).

As bad as Delaware's process may be, it is less instrusive and costly than many.  It is a may-issue that effectively operates as a shall-issue, as long as there are no hiccups (or ex-wives) in a person's past.  And the only major obstacle added in the last twenty years was the training requirement.  We're also lucky (I know, I know -- I just puked after typing that word) in the fact that we don't need a road map of places where we can and cannot carry.  For the most part, strap it on, walk out of the house -- and you're good.  Of course, I always see darkness in the sky, due to our proximity to America's dual-anus area (Jersey and Maryland -- which gains further support from DC and New York).

Personally, if I were to go to battle for any recipricocity issue -- it would be for Maryland. 
Very few guns are actually "illegal guns."  A gun misappropriated by a criminal is no more of an "illegal gun" than a stolen car is an "illegal car."

NormH3

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Re: WV residents with CCW can carry in Delaware...why?
« Reply #5 on: August 21, 2016, 02:50:42 PM »
There are countless ways that I am offended by the State, the County, and simply put -- most of the short-bussers that I encounter once I leave the house.  The West Virginia situation, though, does not rise to the level of causing me more alarm.

I am not sure of West Virgini's current permitting system, but earlier this year West Virginia switched to being a "constitutional carry" state -- so no permit at all. I haven't looked, but they may have kept the permits for recipricocity (for those wanting to take advantage of such a thing).

As bad as Delaware's process may be, it is less instrusive and costly than many.  It is a may-issue that effectively operates as a shall-issue, as long as there are no hiccups (or ex-wives) in a person's past.  And the only major obstacle added in the last twenty years was the training requirement.  We're also lucky (I know, I know -- I just puked after typing that word) in the fact that we don't need a road map of places where we can and cannot carry.  For the most part, strap it on, walk out of the house -- and you're good.  Of course, I always see darkness in the sky, due to our proximity to America's dual-anus area (Jersey and Maryland -- which gains further support from DC and New York).

Personally, if I were to go to battle for any recipricocity issue -- it would be for Maryland. 

West Virginians need to still get a state permit if they wish to carry in other states that require one. Unfortunately Maryland has reciprocity with no other state and will most likely remain that way until they lift the "good and substantial" reason that is required for a resident to acquire one. Apparently, protecting ones own life or those of a loved one isn't good enough. If a WV resident who has a WV CCW can carry in Delaware with just a simple form and a background check, then as a resident of Delaware, I should be able to do the same. It's a double standard. Case in point, NH Supreme court recently ruled that it was unconstitutional for that state to deny a non-residence a carry permit if they DID NOT already have a carry permit in their home state.

CorBon

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Re: WV residents with CCW can carry in Delaware...why?
« Reply #6 on: August 21, 2016, 07:12:41 PM »
There are countless ways that I am offended by the State, the County, and simply put -- most of the short-bussers that I encounter once I leave the house.  The West Virginia situation, though, does not rise to the level of causing me more alarm.

I am not sure of West Virgini's current permitting system, but earlier this year West Virginia switched to being a "constitutional carry" state -- so no permit at all. I haven't looked, but they may have kept the permits for recipricocity (for those wanting to take advantage of such a thing).

As bad as Delaware's process may be, it is less instrusive and costly than many.  It is a may-issue that effectively operates as a shall-issue, as long as there are no hiccups (or ex-wives) in a person's past.  And the only major obstacle added in the last twenty years was the training requirement.  We're also lucky (I know, I know -- I just puked after typing that word) in the fact that we don't need a road map of places where we can and cannot carry.  For the most part, strap it on, walk out of the house -- and you're good.  Of course, I always see darkness in the sky, due to our proximity to America's dual-anus area (Jersey and Maryland -- which gains further support from DC and New York).

Personally, if I were to go to battle for any recipricocity issue -- it would be for Maryland. 

West Virginians need to still get a state permit if they wish to carry in other states that require one. Unfortunately Maryland has reciprocity with no other state and will most likely remain that way until they lift the "good and substantial" reason that is required for a resident to acquire one. Apparently, protecting ones own life or those of a loved one isn't good enough. If a WV resident who has a WV CCW can carry in Delaware with just a simple form and a background check, then as a resident of Delaware, I should be able to do the same. It's a double standard. Case in point, NH Supreme court recently ruled that it was unconstitutional for that state to deny a non-residence a carry permit if they DID NOT already have a carry permit in their home state.

We have to pick our battles.  Frankly, I am not willing to battle over reciprocal arrangements with a non-border state.  If we're going to press for something important, that may be one thing.  Otherwise, we may end up with the patchwork of places that we can and can't go, or at least moving in that direction -- as the West Virginia statute cited at the very bottom indicates.

It is also important to note that the applicable state for obtaining a West Virginia license to carry a deadly weapon includes a course requirement.  That is why Delaware has an agreement with them.

Sorry for the perhaps-difficult-to-read formatting, but not all sites like iPad formatting.

WEST VIRGINIA CODE
§61-7-4.
License to carry deadly weapons; how obtained.
     (a) Except as provided in subsection (h) of this section, any person desiring to obtain a state license to carry a concealed deadly weapon shall apply to the sheriff of his or her county for the license, and pay to the sheriff, at the time of application, a fee of $75, of which $15 of that amount shall be deposited in the Courthouse Facilities Improvement Fund created by section six, article twenty-six, chapter twenty-nine of this code. Concealed weapons permits may only be issued for pistols or revolvers. Each applicant shall file with the sheriff a complete application, as prepared by the Superintendent of the West Virginia State Police, in writing, duly verified, which sets forth only the following licensing requirements:

     (11) That the applicant has qualified under the minimum requirements set forth in subsection (d) of this section for handling and firing the weapon: Provided, That this requirement shall be waived in the case of a renewal applicant who has previously qualified; and

     (d) All persons applying for a license must complete a training course in handling and firing a handgun. The successful completion of any of the following courses fulfills this training requirement:

     (1) Any official National Rifle Association handgun safety or training course;

     (2) Any handgun safety or training course or class available to the general public offered by an official law-enforcement organization, community college, junior college, college or private or public institution or organization or handgun training school utilizing instructors certified by the institution;

     (3) Any handgun training or safety course or class conducted by a handgun instructor certified as such by the state or by the National Rifle Association;

     (4) Any handgun training or safety course or class conducted by any branch of the United States Military, Reserve or National Guard or proof of other handgun qualification received while serving in any branch of the United States Military, Reserve or National Guard.

     A photocopy of a certificate of completion of any of the courses or classes or an affidavit from the instructor, school, club, organization or group that conducted or taught the course or class attesting to the successful completion of the course or class by the applicant or a copy of any document which shows successful completion of the course or class is evidence of qualification under this section.






WEST VIRGINIA CODE. §61-7-14. Right of certain persons to limit possession of firearms on premises.



Notwithstanding  the provisions of this article, any owner, lessee or other person charged with the care, custody and control of real property may prohibit the carrying openly or concealed of any firearm or deadly weapon on property under his or her domain:Provided, That for purposes of this section "person" means an individual or any entity which may acquire title to real property.
Any person carrying or possessing a firearm or other deadly weapon on the property of another who refuses to temporarily relinquish possession of such firearm or other deadly weapon, upon being requested to do so, or to leave such premises, while in possession of such firearm or other deadly weapon, shall be guilty of a misdemeanor, and, upon conviction thereof, shall be fined not more than one thousand dollars or confined in the county jail not more than six months, or both: Provided, That the provisions of this section shall not apply to those persons set forth in subsections (3) through (6) of section six of this code while such persons are acting in an official capacity:  Provided, however, That under no circumstances may any person possess or carry or cause the possession or carrying of any firearm or other deadly weapon on the premises of any primary or secondary educational facility in this state unless such person is a law-enforcement officer or he or she has the express written permission of the county school superintendent.




Very few guns are actually "illegal guns."  A gun misappropriated by a criminal is no more of an "illegal gun" than a stolen car is an "illegal car."

Adrenolin

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Re: WV residents with CCW can carry in Delaware...why?
« Reply #7 on: August 21, 2016, 10:18:55 PM »
Hmmm.. Who cares? Do you think WV should be removed from DE's reciprocity because they don't have as many steps to get their WV permit? Delaware has had it's currently process in place, mostly, for over 100 years and nothing is going to change that with the political lefties up north in charge. Instead of thinking it's unfair try to be happy for WV folks.

Personally, I have no issues with Delaware's process except for the Published Intent bit. I find that wrong on so many levels but it's not going to change anytime soon. Overall the entire process, while requiring many steps, is not that difficult, time consuming or that expensive. For what it is, were fairly lucky with how the approvals are granted for being a "May Issue" state in the first place.

NormH3

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Re: WV residents with CCW can carry in Delaware...why?
« Reply #8 on: August 25, 2016, 06:50:15 PM »
Hmmm.. Who cares? Do you think WV should be removed from DE's reciprocity because they don't have as many steps to get their WV permit? Delaware has had it's currently process in place, mostly, for over 100 years and nothing is going to change that with the political lefties up north in charge. Instead of thinking it's unfair try to be happy for WV folks.

Personally, I have no issues with Delaware's process except for the Published Intent bit. I find that wrong on so many levels but it's not going to change anytime soon. Overall the entire process, while requiring many steps, is not that difficult, time consuming or that expensive. For what it is, were fairly lucky with how the approvals are granted for being a "May Issue" state in the first place.

Actually, I care. Yes you are pretty much able to get a CC permit in Delaware if you apply. The fact that you have to put an ad in the paper, get 5 acquaintances from your county to sign off, a set of finger prints, have it approved by the DA and then have it approved by a Judge. Let's not mention a possible 6 month wait for an answer. I get the training part. It behooves anyone who owns a firearm to get training and practice. Then I look at what a WV resident needs to be able to legally carry a firearm in the State of Delaware. Training, a simple one page form, background check by a local Sheriff and info passed on to WVSP. God bless WV residents.

oldgraygeek

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Re: WV residents with CCW can carry in Delaware...why?
« Reply #9 on: August 25, 2016, 09:25:23 PM »
Hmmm.. Who cares? Do you think WV should be removed from DE's reciprocity because they don't have as many steps to get their WV permit? Delaware has had it's currently process in place, mostly, for over 100 years and nothing is going to change that with the political lefties up north in charge. Instead of thinking it's unfair try to be happy for WV folks.

Personally, I have no issues with Delaware's process except for the Published Intent bit. I find that wrong on so many levels but it's not going to change anytime soon. Overall the entire process, while requiring many steps, is not that difficult, time consuming or that expensive. For what it is, were fairly lucky with how the approvals are granted for being a "May Issue" state in the first place.

Actually, I care. Yes you are pretty much able to get a CC permit in Delaware if you apply. The fact that you have to put an ad in the paper, get 5 acquaintances from your county to sign off, a set of finger prints, have it approved by the DA and then have it approved by a Judge. Let's not mention a possible 6 month wait for an answer. I get the training part. It behooves anyone who owns a firearm to get training and practice. Then I look at what a WV resident needs to be able to legally carry a firearm in the State of Delaware. Training, a simple one page form, background check by a local Sheriff and info passed on to WVSP. God bless WV residents.

I didn't mind the process too much when I went through it: I was self-employed, so nobody I knew spotted the notice in the News-Journal.

My wife, however, works for a large utility company. The day her ad appeared, someone said in a conference room (while everyone was settling down for the actual meeting), "So, _______, I saw your ad in the paper. Getting a carry permit?"
She wasn't pleased, but she made the best of it by turning it into a brief general discussion of the Second Amendment.

Of course, my wife was born and raised in a town that was captured and sacked by the Nazis. She sleeps better with guns & ammo in the house.
"She's petite, extremely beautiful, and heavily armed."
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NormH3

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Re: WV residents with CCW can carry in Delaware...why?
« Reply #10 on: August 30, 2016, 05:16:13 PM »
Was hoping to get a few more comments. I guess the "I got mine" holds true here. Think about what I have posted.

Adrenolin

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Re: WV residents with CCW can carry in Delaware...why?
« Reply #11 on: August 31, 2016, 02:14:39 AM »
Was hoping to get a few more comments. I guess the "I got mine" holds true here. Think about what I have posted.

Still don't see the huge issue. So its easier to get a permit in WV then it is in DE. Many states its easier. Additionally.. how many WVians do you think are carrying here? I see a couple WV license plates a month so its not many. As far as I'm concerned any other state CCDW permit holder should be able to carry here or in any other state. Hopefully this gets passed within the next few years!

Don't take issues with WV being easy to get and able to carry here. Take issue with the requirements here and if so bad, try to get them changed!

Sinker

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Re: WV residents with CCW can carry in Delaware...why?
« Reply #12 on: August 31, 2016, 10:11:09 AM »
Was hoping to get a few more comments. I guess the "I got mine" holds true here. Think about what I have posted.
I agree that the inequity seems ridiculous, but I didn't comment because you asked a question I can't answer. 

NormH3

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Re: WV residents with CCW can carry in Delaware...why?
« Reply #13 on: August 31, 2016, 04:08:34 PM »
Was hoping to get a few more comments. I guess the "I got mine" holds true here. Think about what I have posted.

Still don't see the huge issue. So its easier to get a permit in WV then it is in DE. Many states its easier. Additionally.. how many WVians do you think are carrying here? I see a couple WV license plates a month so its not many. As far as I'm concerned any other state CCDW permit holder should be able to carry here or in any other state. Hopefully this gets passed within the next few years!

Don't take issues with WV being easy to get and able to carry here. Take issue with the requirements here and if so bad, try to get them changed!

Well we can agree to disagree. As far as WV residents being able to carry here, It's up to our AG, not their's. Different rules for different folk I guess.

NormH3

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Re: WV residents with CCW can carry in Delaware...why?
« Reply #14 on: August 31, 2016, 04:09:49 PM »
Was hoping to get a few more comments. I guess the "I got mine" holds true here. Think about what I have posted.
I agree that the inequity seems ridiculous, but I didn't comment because you asked a question I can't answer. 

In reality, It is a question for the Delaware AG. However, I'm not going to be that guy and possibly ruin it for WV residents who choose to carry here. :)